"Joe
I was on CNN.com and was watching the ireport about California passing prop 8, and after the last few days of actually feeling proud to be an American (for the first time in many years), some of the comments left by people viewing the story made me feel sick. That just 2 days ago the country could come together and elect an African American man as president and still be this closed minded and hateful towards gays is truly a sad day for this country. Im not a very religious person (i don't actively practice any mainstream religion) but i believe that if you live a good life and don't steal, commit adultery, lie, commit murder and don't have hate in your heart towards people that are different from you, you will be just fine in this world and what ever may come when you pass on. Anyway about 2 pages into the comments there was a person that, i felt made his point without hate in his heart, and truly expressed what the meaning of this great country is, here is his post."
tylerBlog wrote
"Remember America, once in our dark history, blacks had to use a separate restroom, and once women couldn't vote.
I am a heterosexual male, so I got to legally marry the one I love. WHY are same sex couples denied the same rights and privileges as EVERYONE ELSE? It's really only one word - HATE
This is almost the year 2009 (not the 1950's) and Right Wing White Christian America needs to grow some compassion already. If you are hateful enough to vote to ban gay marriages, why don't you go ahead and try and make gay people sit in the back of the bus, and use separate water fountains and restrooms. Why don't you put up signs in restaurants the say "No Gays"... hell, why not try and get Congress to classify them as "Less Than Human" or "Sub-Human" - because by making a law that keeps someone from being able to mary the person that they love, you are saying that they are less than human, because they don't have the same rights as every OTHER human.
GROW UP AMERICA... your old fashioned ancient religions don't govern society anymore...
and I'm sick of the argument " well, if two men can get married, how am I supposed to explain that to my child?" That's the rudest argument of all... You're basically saying someone can't mary the person they love simply because you don't want to have to explain it to your child? Feel free to tell your children that gay marriage is wrong, or whatever beliefs you want to instill in your child, but YOU CAN'T DENY ANYONE THERE BASIC RIGHTS AS A HUMAN BEING... and marrying the one you love is one of those rights. If you vote to ban gay marriage, you are trampling on Freedom, and our forefathers will roll over in their graves."
I've not been reading your blog long enough to have caught your views on gays, but from your posts in the last few days, I'm hoping that your open minded enough right now to post this and maybe make people think for once less about how other peoples actions may make them look and how their actions are making them look to the rest of the world.
Thank you,
Chris
DelMarVa's Premier Source for News, Opinion, Analysis, and Human Interest Contact Publisher Joe Albero at alberobutzo@wmconnect.com or 410-430-5349
72 comments:
Well, Chris is certainly entitled
to his opinion. But , remember that
religion runs very deep. Nature has a way of weeding out . HIV
being 1 example. They can't have
children , so they will die-out
in time.
Chris,
It really is disgust. Most Americans know the disgust of this un-natural behavior. Some of us have a religious foundation. All religions recognize perverse sexuality as an abomination. The Jewish Old Testament has a story of 2 cities being completely exterminated because of this sexual pervertedness. Hetero-sexual activity becomes perverse also, when its actions go beyond the purposes of love and life. All perverse sexual behavior is condemned by most all religions. America has been sabotaged by a Humanistic Philosophy that teaches we are our own gods. Because we have learned some of the secrets of the laws of the universe, we believe we are its masters. We are not. Our master is a fallen angel, and he is leading us down a wicked path of self-destruction.
Why is it insisted that they call it marriage? Marriage should be between a man and a woman that can proliferate. Call it something else and maybe it will pass. What you do is your business but if you want to have a gay union call it that not marriage.
I think the "religious" argument for homosexuality should be argued in religious circles, not in public, political circles. We are supposed to have separation of church and state. Also, to say it's unnatural ignores that fact that homosexuality occurs throughout all animals species, on average, just below 10% of a population. So the "unnatural" argument doesn't hold water. To say gays can't reproduce so we'll eventually die out is ignorant. You do realize that your male father and female mother are the ones giving birth to the vast majority of homosexual human beings don't you? We're not going to "die out" because you all keep having sex and creating us. We are a natural part of the human continum. I don't know why there's homosexuality in humans anymore than I know why it occurs in all animal species. I don't know why some of us are left-handed as opposed to right-handed. It wasn't that long ago when left-handed people were considered evil. The left hand in some cultures today is still reserved for dirty or unclean jobs such as wiping one's butt.
I believe homosexuality is nature's way of covering all the bases for our survival. Procreation isn't the only thing that helps us survive, so does adaptation, cooperation and forming loving groups for protection and survival.
I heard this is the second time California has voted on this. After they voted to not allow gay marriage it was taken to court and over turned. If was voted on again during the elections and they voted against it again. Seems like the people have spoken as to what they want. People want us to unite behind a presidnet most of us didn't vote for but they want to bitch if something they wanted didn't get voted it. THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN..... twice!
8:11,
I hate to tell you this, but I have 2 kids. Also, my parents are heterosexual. Hmmm . . it doesn't look like we are dying out! Nice argument about HIV, though. I guess since lesbians are the least likely population to get HIV, it must be a message from God that He favors lesbians! Whoo hoo! What about smallpox and the plague? Kinda nailed you heteros a lot in the past. And 8:18, I have to say, it sounds like you could use a little action in the bedroom! I was bummed about the CA deal, but I am confident that eventually America will come around to see that discrimination in any form is wrong. I don't know why straight peole spend so much time imagining what we do in the bedroom--I certainly don't like to think about what Anon 8:18 is doing! And whatever he or she IS (Or more likely is NOT) doing in the bedroom does not define them. Nor does it define me. Why people care seems rather odd to me.
Well said, C! Why do people care? I do agree that maybe calling it marriage is unnecessary (and I am gay), but if you think aobut it, gov't really should just get out of the marriage department entirely anyway.
I've been waiting my entire adult life to hear someone make an argument against gay marriage that isn't based on fairy tales from a book. Still waiting.
OK... I am going to set you'll "straight"... as far as anon 8:11 is concerned, religion can run as deep as it wants in this county, it does NOT matter, the constitution says there is a separation between church and state. Prop 8 has to be decided because their constitution says it's legal, NOT because of religious purposes.
HIV? As a matter of fact, gay males have one of the lowest HIV rates, the top groups with HIV are indeed Black women, Black men, White woman, then gay men. So that's a fact that you need understand.
Who will die out in time? Gay people have straight parents... how will they die out?
Anon 8:18, un-natural behavior? Did you know over 125 species of animals participate in homosexual behavior? It's not unnatural.
Anon 8:47, marriage or union, what's the difference? What's the problem?
What kind of person has to have someone (or group) to look down, to treat as inferior? Watching people cheer taking someone elses rights away.
Exit polls: McCain received 27% of the gay vote (up from 20% four years ago);
Most any Republican candidate for President has received from gay voters
Marriage isn't just in the bedroom. Marriage and marriage laws came about because when the male head of household died the widow was left with nothing and the children suffered, so things had to change and they did. When a gay couple says they love each other, that's great but they won't have these problems to worry about. They should not be recognized by law as a married couple for this very reason. Like another poster said, go ahead proclaim your love for each other, but call it something else. Tradition over centuries has made marriage what it is between man and a woman and has nothing to do with what they do in the bedroom but what happens when one of them is taken from the family they have created. This is not about hate, it's not about the bedroom.
Yes, to almost every religion out there, being gay is not allowed. One still needs to remember that church and state are supposed to be seperate. Therefor religion should not be the excuse for gay couples to be married. If they want to be married, than they should also deal with divorce the same way as "regular" couples do.
In Defense of Marriage
• Ronald Reagan - divorced the mother of two of his children to marry Nancy Reagan, who bore him a daughter only 7 months after the marriage.
• Bob Dole - divorced the mother of his child, who had nursed him through the long recovery from his war wounds.
• Newt Gingrich - divorced his wife who was dying of cancer.
• Dick Armey - House Majority Leader - divorced
• Sen. Phil Gramm of Texas - divorced
• Gov. John Engler of Michigan - divorced
• Gov. Pete Wilson of California - divorced
• George Will - divorced
• Sen. Lauch Faircloth - divorced
• Rush Limbaugh - Rush and his current wife Marta have six marriages and four divorces between them.
• Rep. Bob Barr of Georgia - Barr, not yet 50 years old, has been married three times. Barr had the audacity to author and push the "Defense of Marriage Act." The current joke making the rounds on Capitol Hill is "Bob Barr...WHICH marriage are you defending?!?
• Sen. Alfonse D'Amato of New York - divorced
• Sen. John Warner of Virginia - divorced (once married to Liz Taylor.)
• Gov. George Allen of Virginia - divorced
• Henry Kissinger - divorced
• Rep. Helen Chenoweth of Idaho - divorced
• Sen. John McCain of Arizonia - divorced
• Rep. John Kasich of Ohio - divorced
• Rep. Susan Molinari of New York - Republican National Convention Keynote Speaker - divorced
So ... homosexuals are going to destroy the institution of marriage? Wait a minute, it seems the Christian Republicans are doing a fine job without anyone's help!
tedh -- has nailed it.
Try calling it something other then a marriage. A civil union with all the rights of a marriage, maybe. Marriage is for the union of a man and woman. Where are most marriages conducted? In churches! I don't know of any church that would hold a "marriage" for a gay couple.
I don't have a problem with gay people being together. I have several friends and coworkers that are gay. If they want to solidify their relationship and commit to each other great! Come up with some way it can be done for them without calling it a marriage. But if they do commit to each other in this way I believe they should be able to get health insurance, medical rights, etc.... just like a "married" heterosexual couple.
There should be some way to comprise on this issue that makes every one happy.
With elections round the corner
When the voters start to care
About the mess we have created
We give you issues that aren't even there
We give you Homosexual marriage
Gonna wreck your family's life
Gay men want your husbands
Lesbians will steal your wife
Lies lit up the daytime
Till bombs lit up the night
Bin Laden sleeps in a cave somewhere
While in Iraq our soldiers die and fight
We give you Homosexual marriage
Gonna wreck your family's life
Gay men want your husbands
Lesbians will steal your wife
Billy Frist and Arlen Spector
Know the votes are just not there
Orrin Hatch said "Go tell all of your wives"
In his sacred Mormon underwear
Gas will be four bucks a gallon
Katrina's wrath is still unfixed
The deficit is at an all-time high
While Republicans play politics
They give us Homosexual marriage
Gonna wreck your family's life
Gay men want your husbands
Lesbians will steal your wife
With scandal all around us
Indictments everywhere you look
We ask ourselves what would Jesus do?
He'd said "Hey! Look out, what that over there"
It must be Homosexual marriage
Gonna wreck your family's life
Gay men want your husbands
Lesbians will steal your wife
Just remember there's a price paid
For each inflammatory thing you say
Mathew Sheppard's safe in heaven dead
How many other souls will have to pay
You give them Homosexual marriage
It won't affect your family's life
Gay men don't want your husband
Lesbians won't steal your wife
I have been waiting patiently.
I have been staring with great anticipation out the window of my flat here in the heart of San Francisco, sighing heavily, waiting for the riots and the plagues and the screaming monkeys and the blistering rain of inescapable hellfire. I have my camera all ready and everything.
There has been nothing. I see only some lovely trees and a stunning blue sky and my neighbor walking by with her pair of matching chow chows as a pained-looking woman struggles to parallel park her SUV. Same old, same old.
And this is San Francisco, gay-marriage HQ, Sodom-and-Gomorrahville, debauchery central. We are supposed to be careening off the nice, safe road of social acceptability right now, welcoming chaos, exploding into a fiery hellmist of our own sick godless depravity and dropping off the disgusted planet any minute now.
Where is my raging apocalypse? This is what I want to know. Where is the social meltdown? The moral depravity? I was promised an apocalypse, dammit. What am I supposed to do with all these tubs of margarine and confetti and kazoos?
There have been more than 3,500 gay-marriage ceremonies in San Francisco so far. Hundreds more are just now kicking up a storm in Oregon and in beautifully rebellious little burgs around New York state. And, yet, nothing. No chaos. No reign of terror. Not even a lousy heat wave. Sigh.
Some homosexual couples have been married for more than three weeks now, living in utter godless sin as they drive their cars and shop and laugh and cry and go to work and pay their taxes and wonder about their dreams. Lightning has not struck them dead. The Hellmouth has not opened wide its gaping maw, hankering for some of the City's trademark Sourdough o' Sin. I am dumbfounded.
After all, gay marriage is supposed to ruin the nation, is it not? Induce actual rioting and civil unrest and shirtless anarchy as millions of stupefied citizens pray to a bloody pulverized Mel Gibson-y Jesus for redemption, as they suddenly begin questioning whether ogling the Pottery Barn catalog for more than 10 minutes might mean they're gay.
"It's anarchy," some guy named Rick Forcier, of the Washington state chapter of the Christian Coalition, actually whined. "We seem to have lost the rule of law. It's very frightening when every community decides what laws they will obey." Why, yes, Rick. It's total anarchy. Just look at all the screaming and the bloodshed and the gunfire. Run and hide, Rick. The gay people in love are coming. And they've got tattoos and funny haircuts and want to get married and celebrate their love and be left alone. Hide the children.
This was -- and still is -- very much the right-wing sentiment. It was almost a guarantee: Same-sex marriage spelled the instantaneous end of all that is good and righteous and edible. Insurrection was imminent, apocalypse nigh. You could see it in their eyes -- they could hardly wait.
Hell, even Governator Arnie went on "Meet the Press" recently and proclaimed, semicoherently, that he was actually worried about the riots and deadly mayhem should S.F. continue with its brazen lawlessness. And look. Nothing. Not a peep. Not a single rabid spitting demon to be seen. Unless you count Lynne Cheney. Which you never, ever should.
I believe I have been misled. I was told repeatedly in extra-glowing terminology by multiple raging Bible-quoting drones that The Good Book expressly forbids gay marriage and gay sex, and to engage in either spells imminent doom and instant social bedlam and there are specific verses all about it.
Is this true? Are there actual verses decrying gay marriage? Are they anything like those other Biblical verses, about the rules and regulations surrounding marriage that are making the rounds on the Net right now? Real verses. Actual verses. Verses o' sanctimonious fun. Have you seen them?
Like this: "Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take multiple concubines in addition to his wife or wives." (II Sam 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chron 11:21).
Or maybe: "A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If the wife is not a virgin, she shall be stoned to death." (Deut 22:13-21) Isn't that cute? Isn't quoting Bible verse fun? Ask your local pastor about that one.
Or how about: "If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise punished in a manner to be determined by law." (Gen. 38:6-10; Deut 25:5-10). Hey, it's right there, in the Bible. So it must be true.
Is it worth showing those verses to the happily sanctimonious and sneering Christian homophobes who are protesting outside S.F. City Hall right now, telling the gay couples what depraved hell-bound sinners they all are? Nah. Why spoil their whiny apocalyptic wet dreams? Live and let live, I always say.
(Oh, and while we're at it, God also really hates shrimp. Maybe you didn't know. Shrimp are evil, as are all shrimp eaters. Clams, too. Hey, it's in the Bible. You can look it up. Why the Right is attacking homosexuals in love and not, say, Red Lobster, remains a mystery.)
So, here we are. Approaching a full month after the first of S.F.'s marriage ceremonies, and nothing. The universe is smiling madly. The world is shrugging. Anonymous supporters from all over the nation have sent flowers to hundreds of loving gay and lesbian couples. As of this writing, there is no scathing hellfire. No fanged demons of destruction (Lynne Cheney excepted). No meltdown whatsoever. I would know, right? I mean, wouldn't the power go out, or something?
Maybe it's still to come. Maybe total screaming misery and unspeakable sociocultural collapse coupled with wanton bestiality and incest and the giving away of free anal beads to innocent teenagers takes more than a month. Maybe I'm just a little impatient.
Maybe Satan is taking his sweet time to marshal his leather-clad armies, watching as other U.S. cities get in on the gay-marriage act, listening as mayors and governors all chime in their support and say what's the big deal. Maybe Beelzebub is waiting for a big moment so as to really leverage the coming news flash, the special report, the sudden activation of the Emergency Broadcast System. Something like:
"This just in: Earthquakes rocked the globe today as giant fire-breathing bees of death swarmed the countryside, feasting on fat white heterosexual babies mostly from Texas and Colorado Springs and Utah and Idaho, as the institution of hetero marriage careened around the mad vortex of space-time like a savage drunken pinball high on black-tar heroin, just like the Christian Right predicted.
"Horrors bled into the streets, terrorists were spawned by the thousand, presidents openly lied so as to lead a nation into bloody violent unwinnable wars, thousands of Catholic priests sexually molested tens of thousands of children over a 50-year period without the slightest punishment, the environment teetered on the brink due to heartless government rollbacks as air quality and water quality and food sources were ravaged in the name of corporate profiteering, the economy crumbled like Jenna Bush after her 10th beer bong as hate and fear and bogus Orange Alerts ruled the land."
Oh wait. That was all before the gay-marriage thing. My bad.
Big vote in the Senate yesterday. They voted down the gay marriage ban. ... It was a very close vote. 43 voted 'yea.' 44 voted 'nay.' And 3 voted 'fabulous.'
Anon 9:07, I assure you, if my partner dies, I and my children will suffer because we have none of the government benefits or protections that married couples have.
Anon 8:56, I agree, government should get out of marriage and take all their benefits with them. Then gays wouldn't want to be married. Problem solved.
What people are conveniently ignoring is that it isn't really about marriage as much as it is about all the government benefits and protections that married couples with children have that same-sex couples with children don't have. We're all paying into the same tax system that allows these benefits, but only "privileged" citizens get to benefit from them. I'd like to withdraw my tax dollars from anything benefitting married couples.
President Bush said he was 'troubled' by gay people getting married in San Francisco. He said on important issues like this the people should make the decision, not judges. Unless of course we're choosing a president, then he prefers judges.
im sorry but gay marriage is not something we should be legalizing..what next a few people want to marry sheep and that will be ok..we cant keep changing our morals just because times change.
Anon 9:16, thank you so much for your intelligence and sharp wit. It's a breath of fresh air! BTW, just visited SF a couple of months back, beautiful city, and I didn't see anything unusual in the Castro District. It looked like any other lovely neighborhood with people who care about their properties.
9:37, so uphold your morals?
1) Being gay is not natural. Real Americans always reject unnatural things like eyeglasses, polyester, and air conditioning. Also apparently those homosexual animals have picked up some unnatural behavior.
2) Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people will make you tall.
3) Gay marriage will change the foundation of society; we could never adapt to new social norms. Just like we haven't adapted to cars, the service-sector economy, or longer life spans.
4) Straight marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all; women are still property, blacks still can't marry whites, and divorce is still illegal.
5) Straight marriage will be less meaningful if gay marriage were allowed; the sanctity of Britney Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage would be destroyed.
6) Straight marriages are valid because they produce children. Gay couples, infertile couples, and old people shouldn't be allowed to marry because our orphanages aren't full yet, and the world needs more children.
7) Obviously gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.
8) Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.
9) Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why we as a society expressly forbid single parents to raise children.
10) Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage contract.
Just sittin here thinking about the people many years ago. I wonder if there were gay cave men or women . I wonder if there are gay lions and tigers? I wonder what the hell is wrong with humans!!
1. i cannot believe that anon 8:11 thinks HIV evolved to kill gay people. HIV can happen to anyone ANYONE, anon 8:11. Even you are not immune, none of us are.
2. to anon 8:18: evidence of this so called "unnatural behavoir" exists in the wild...aka it exist in nature. look it up.
3. to tedh 8:47: equal rights for all people, that's why we want to call it marriage. for that matter, marriage is nothing more than a certificate, state-issued. and a lot of homosexuals actually religious, and it is our right to have a religious ceremony. we call it marriage because it is the bond between two people who love each other. equal rights for ALL.
4. anon 9:08: GREAT EXAMPLE. This sacred bond of LOVE has been on the decline for centuries. Just because two people who happen to be of the same sex, want to express that bond can do nothing more to destroy the word Marriage than what has already been done in the past.
5. TO ALL: This is NOT about your religion, your gender, your sexuality. Stop using religion as a weapon. Stop saying HIV/AIDS is for gay people. Stop HATING others that are different than yourselves and open up your eyes. We are not here to change your morals!!! KEEP YOUR MORALS TO YOURSELF, YOUR HANDS OUT OF OUR BEDROOMS. GAY MARRIAGE DOES NOT MAKE YOU GAY. WE are not FORCING THIS upon you!!!!
SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE. THIS IS WHAT IS NEEDED.
Hey homophobes:
Did you know gay friendly cities have the highest real estate values.
Did you know gay friendly cities have been affected least by the fall in economy.
Did you know gay friendly cities see the most high technology jobs?
Did you know gay friendly cities see the most educated student coming and staying around because of the job market.
After realizing that the top 5 "gay-friendly" cities in the US -- San Francisco, Seattle, Boston, Portland (Oregon), and Tampa -- are also prosperous centers of technological innovation, Florida decided to do a more thorough study. The results, he said, held up for other cities as well.
If it was the 1960's and we put mixed marriages up for popular vote how do you think that would have come out? For that matter what if popular vote had been used for all the Jim Crow laws? Lets vote and see if blacks should be allowed to vote, go to college, own homes.
Transgender Man Elected Mayor of Silverton
09:40 PM PST on Thursday, November 6, 2008
By JACK PENNING, for kgw.com
The first African-American President. The first time in 40 years an Oregon Senate candidate beat an incumbent Senator. And in tiny Silverton, Oregon, residents have elected the man who's believed to be the first ever openly transgender mayor in the United States.
kgw.com
Stu Rasmussen was recently elected the mayor of Silverton. He is believed to be America's first openly transgender Mayor.
Stu Rasmussen served two terms as the Mayor of Silverton in the 1990s. But he hadn't admitted to being transgender. He's not the same man now that he was then. Today he wears a skirt and high heels. He has breast implants, and long red hair. He looks like a woman - but he's not.
"I indentify mostly as a heterosexual male," Rasmussen said. "But I just like to look like a female."
Rasmussen is a man. He even has a girlfriend. He says he's always been transgender, but he only "came out" a few years ago.
"Some guys mid-life crisis is motorcycles or sports cars or climbing mountains or throphy wives or whatever." Rasmussen said his mid-life crisis was quite different. "I always wanted cleavage, so I went out and aquired some."
With the way he looks, he wasn't sure how his run for Mayor would go.
"The first 30 seconds they think, am I in a freakshow? Is there a camera behind me? What's going on here?" Rasmussen told NewsChannel 8. "And then we get down to dicussing whatever the issue is - city business or business or whatever - and they figure out this guy's different, but he knows what he's talking about."
It's Rasmussen's knowledge of the issues, and of the town, that won over so many voters. As one voter said, "Stu's very devoted to this town."
Rasmussen won by a hefty margin - 13 points. It really wasn't close.
"He wants to maintain the intergrity of Silverton," voter Gail Frassenei said. And she said she isn't sure Rasmussen would be elected anywhere else. "I think it's amazing a small town like this can be so open-minded, to elect someone that's made a life change."
"I'm prejudiced, but I think this is just about the coolest town on Earth," Rasmussen said, just before he broke down, a tear gently running through his eyeliner, and onto his cheek. He can't wait to take office in January. He said he's finally confident enough to be himself, as he runs his hometown, wearning his signature heels.
I gotta say, the majority of the comments here are positive and anti-discrimination! I never would have thought that would be the case. Change is in the air, my friends! Here's the deal--I don't worry too much about all of this, because the young people and future leaders today are far less prejudiced than their parents are about just about anything: gay people, different races, interracial couples, what have you. They really are starting to be against virtually all discrimination. They are the first generation to grow up with openly gay people outisde of the major metropolitan centers, and they are the first to grow up with openly gay people on tv, film, and the internet. ATTENTION PARENTS: YOUR KIDS DO NOT CARE IF SOMEONE IS GAY!!!! And neither do I. I also don't care if you are straight. I care whether you are a good human being. Who are better role models: the two tax paying law abiding women who have lived togather quietly for 50 yerars, or the tubby radio host who gave wife #2 divorce papers while she was in the hospital being treated for cancer, and then went out and married wife #3 while getting illegal prescriptions for Vicodin. That's right, I'm calling you out, heterosexual marriage buster Rush Limbaugh!!!
Give the religious people their term Marriage. But take all state benefits away from the name (tax, power of attorney, visitation, inheritance, etc)
Marriage will give you all the benefits that the church and god can give to your immortal soul.
Create a state based contract that allows anyone who is sharing their lives together to enter. It will be this that you receive all your state based benefits.
True separation of church and state. People cannot receive state based benefits while they are calling marriage "sacred".
I would marry Joe Albero if he wasn't married to beautiful Jennifer and if it was legal...
LOL...
Wait, can I marry sbynews.blogspot.com too??
Sir:
This is "SBYnews"?
Some see the move as an attempt to preserve traditional values, while others see it as a cynical ploy to ensure that Vice President Dick Cheney will never have to pay for his gay daughter's wedding.
Its ok guys..when a gay couple passes away..only god will judge them when they are standing at the gates of heaven. One thing I really don't get is that they say they were born this way? Like how?..Well you know what I was born not to like gays and lesbians. Its disgusting. I don't want to have to explain to my child while two people of the same sex are kissing each other out in public. Gays and Lesbians know its going to bother Straight people..so please why don't you keep that in your bedroom. or move to another place where they except your kind. Thank you
"The Massachusetts court decision to allow gay marriages this week may prove to be a divisive issue in the upcoming presidential election. President Bush is likely torn because he has to protect what he sees as a sacred institution and yet he knows gay marriage would boost the economy because you know those gay guys would go all out. We're talking about designer wedding cakes, $20,000 sleeveless tuxedos, giant naked man ice sculptures that pee mojitos. They'd hire Pattie La Belle as the band, give out African parrots as party favors. It'd be ridiculous. Remember, whatever your political beliefs, a vote to allow gay marriage is a vote for a fabulous economy." - Tina Fey
Wheewww. 31 comments to read through before I try to articulate on this....
As someone who's been divorced, I don't claim to know what the answer to this question, but I do know this-if two humans wish to make a life together, MORE POWER TO 'EM. If they wish to call their life together permanent, and have a religious ceremony to celebrate their relationship among their friends, families, whoever, again, MORE POWER TO THEM. If they wish to create a situation where they are each others "next of kin" and heirs, it's possible to do that without the endorsement of the government.
Conservative groups are demanding that President Bush support a constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage. They feel that when the founding fathers were putting the Constitution together they made a mistake by not outlawing it. Have you ever seen the paintings of the founding fathers? The powdered wigs, the frilly collars, the pedal pushers — I think they were for it.
President Bush says he's troubled by all the gay weddings that have been going on in San Francisco. Bush also says he's troubled by Bert and Ernie's relationship on 'Sesame Street.
the only time two men should ever be in bed together is if one is a lobbyist and one is a politician.
10:24,
Right on! People arguing about the "traditions" of marriage should know that it is only in the last 100 years that the gov't has actually been directly involved in marriages, and only in a minor way up uintil 50 years ago. Those of you who think the Founding Fathers had it all figured out might be surprised to learn that when they were running around, marriage was not a civil contract, but a religious one. So let the religous people have their religious ceremonies and their religious vows, let those of us who prefer a civil contract ensuring gov't benefits get that, and we can all enjoy a good party at the reception!
I dont care about this marrage crap. I want whats mine! I just want the right to persue my happiness. I dont care what you hold sacred, its my rights that matter now, theres many like me and we've been this way for many years. I am a theif and your discriminating against me by not allowing me to take what you hold sacred, its my right to come into your world and take what ever I want! I dont care that everyone has called it wrong since the beginning of time. I WANT WHAT I WANT!!!! So you should just change the law because Im going to do it anyway.
what you do behind your door is your business but when you start to ask me to say its ok and legal its not gonna happen. Gay marriage is immoral..read the bible..remember Sodom and Gomorrah
Economists Dr. Marina Adshade and Prof. Brooks Kaiser argue that marriage originated as a method to ensure that a father had a legal responsibility to provide for his children. Well this is a different twist. Anyway just think about all of the lawyers that will get rich off of gay divorce.
Anon 9:07, I assure you, if my partner dies, I and my children will suffer because we have none of the government benefits or protections that married couples have.
Anon 9:28...you should take care of that right now. Marriage laws say that property is split btwn husband and wife in case of divorce, etc, but there's no reason two people can't put both their names on the mortgage, etc and enjoy the benefits of marriage. When a loser leaves his family for another woman and tries to take everything, then that woman and the children are protected. Gay people don't have to worry about this because the children that they can't possibly have together are a responsibility of one or the other agent in the union before they enter the relationship. It's ridiculous to assume that your children will suffer if your parter left or worse, because they may be treated like both your children, they are only one's children by law and if you have their control but haven't put your name on the important documents, then that's your fault. I'm married with 4 kids, and even though the law would protect me because of my marriage, my name is still on the important documents. Back long ago when women were considered property and incapable of making decisions without their husbands (or it was against the law), common law said a widow could own property and make decisions based on the family. A Gay couple can do these things legally nowadays, and they can perform marriage ceremonies without the recognition of law. The benefits of marriage in the law are not real-what the joint filing of a return-is that a benefit? Family health insurance is more expensive than single health insurance no matter where you go. Even a parent/child policy is less expensive than a married couple's insurance. I don't know what other benefits are bestowed upon the married "class." They are a figment of imagination.
"Marriage shall not impede a man's right to take multiple concubines in addition to his wife or wives." (II Sam 5:13; I Kings 11:3; II Chron 11:21).
"A marriage shall be considered valid only if the wife is a virgin. If the wife is not a virgin, she shall be stoned to death." (Deut 22:13-21)
"If a married man dies without children, his brother shall marry the widow. If he refuses to marry his brother's widow or deliberately does not give her children, he shall pay a fine of one shoe and be otherwise punished in a manner to be determined by law." (Gen. 38:6-10; Deut 25:5-10)
"If two men, a man and his countryman, are struggling together, and the wife of one comes near to deliver her husband from the hand of the one who is striking him, and puts out her hand and seizes his genitals, then you shall cut off her hand; you shall not show pity." (Deuteronomy 25:11-12)
"Yet she increased her prostitution, remembering the days of her youth when she engaged in prostitution in the land of Egypt. She lusted after their genitals as large as those of donkeys, and their seminal emission was as strong as that of stallions." (Ezekiel 23:19-20)
"You also took the fine jewelry I gave you, the jewelry made of my gold and silver, and you made for yourself male idols and engaged in prostitution with them." ( Ezekiel 16:17)
Anon 10:55 - if only God will judge us then what are all of you doing? Also, do you happen to have an extended brow, are a little hirsuite and walk with your knuckles scraping the ground?
Anon 11:01 - too funny!
To the 1st Anon 11:07 - That would really solve all of this, and it's something a number of other countries already do, have a civil marriage system with government benefits and a religious marriage with no government benefits. As long as government and religion are inter-mingling in this institution, we'll never end this argument.
To the 2nd Anon 11:07 - we're not trying to take anything you hold sacred, unless you hold almost 1,138 state and federal laws and benefits protecting you and your family at the expense of other tax paying families, sacred. I'm paying for those benefits you hold sacred. I'd like that money back. You straight people haven't been upholding the institution of marriage very well and society is no longer benefitting from propping up this institution for you.
Anon 11:11 - How provincial! You are aware not everyone reads or believes in your Bible or your God, right? I'm talking even people on your street and in your town. You are aware our Founding Fathers were trying to avoid religious persecution and a theocracy when they established this country, right? So then, why are you trying to make the rest of this country follow a code established by your church? If you think that's right or fair, then my church and the 100s of other churches should also be allowed to pass laws to tell you how to live and what you can and cannot do. Careful, public stonings are coming to a square near you!
anon 11:11 - spare your Bible interpreting BS for someone who cares...you worship your God, I'll worship mine...I like mine a lot better though because he/she's much more compassionate and forgiving and can't be bought based upon how much you put into the collection plate on Sunday morning - that is while you drink and swear and gamble and spread hate during the week. There's a special place on the other side for folk like you...I hope you are able to see the error of your ways before you get ther. God Bless...
"GROW UP AMERICA... your old fashioned ancient religions don't govern society anymore..." COULD THIS BE WHY AMERICA IS GOING TO SHIT?
WOW.....while we are drawing comparisons I would like to add that until recently,mixed race marriages between a man and woman were ILLEGAL in many states.
I have always thought that gays can't F*ck up marriage any worse than straight people have but I do draw the line at calling it "marriage" ......HOWEVER why can't they be given the benefit of civil unions?Granted,there would have to be strict protocols or anyone that shacked up (gay or straight)would claim they were "married" to get benefits!As for AIDS,gay men were the 1st to show signs of the disease....over 20 yrs later it is mostly hetero men who have it.
"And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth." King James Version, Genesis 1:28
Just to make a point well known...a true Christian loves one another as a brother or sister. We may not like what they do but we are ALL sinners and mankind is the one who has determined which sins are "worse" than others. Remember in Gods eyes, he loves us all - this includes if you are gay, straight, red, yellow, black or white!!! I am a Christian and I do not believe in gay marriages but God will be the one whom we will ALL answer to, whether you believe that or not, one day, you will see. As for now, I will pray for this country, it's leaders, and it's people no matter what color they are or how they chose to express their love to one another. GOD BLESS YOU ALL!
lol you all say this crap about religion but you use this as an excuse has anyone on here seen god hes a frigging invisible man that doesent exist thats your excuse for not letting gays get married come on so what if 2 men or 2 women wanna be married since you are all in twined with religion most of you on here only let it apply for your own satisfaction to make yourselves feel holy lol idiots let them marry who they want and god dont exist later idiots
WOw...talk about someone who hates. It sounded like some hate coming from this person.
I am happy that CA finally stood up and defined marriage as between a man and woman only. No, I am not a gay basher nor a hatemonger. I am someone who believes that a marriage is between a man and a woman. If it is defined as something less, then marriage as we know it will eventually erode to nothing but a word. If you continue to erode marriage by changing its definition, then the liberals in this world will eventually cry adn whine to define marriage as a union between anyone and anything. Sorry...I am not for that. I do not want to see my lab adn my neighbor's pug get "married" You know where that can go. Leave marriage alone.
Romans and Greeks have been through this. They didn't discourage it. Some even encouraged it. I don't care to be honest. I have my fiance. And I have no desire to be gay. Does it bother me if someone else is...nope. I have gay friends and they tend to be the most heart warming people ever. They are happy with themselves, and know what they want in life. Shouldn't we all be so lucky? And I don't think that the Greeks and Romans could be considered any less civilized than we are. Anyone who says they are less civilized, well....REALLY?
I think there is alot bigger fish to fry in this nation right now, straight, gay or what-ever, if we dont focus on the larger issues were all gonna be broke. In the end we are all AMERICANS...
I find it absurd that when one side wishes to dismiss the other sides point of view, they start throwing around the "hate" word. Grow the f!&$ up!
I have gay friends and family that I love very much. I do not agree with their union being called "marriage" but I do believe they are entitled to the same rights that I am. And I do not hate either of them.
Anon 11:22 - I am not mad at you for being uninformed. If you've never experienced the discrimination, or knew someone who has, how would you know it existed? There are many benefits and protections you receive because you're married that gay partners cannot contract for. It wasn't until this year that the State of Maryland would allow me to inherit my own house from my partner without paying an inheritance tax. If your spouse dies, the house is yours without paying tax. Did you realize many gay people in this state and others were in danger of losing their homes because they couldn't afford to pay the inheritance tax on the other half of their home when their partner died? When your spouse dies, you will be able to collect his/her social security. I and my partner pay into the same tax system, but we don't get the same benefits. When my partner dies, all that money she paid in goes to the government or to supplement social security payments to the survivors of married relationships. Is it fair for us to pay into a system that benefits you and your spouse but not me and my partner? As for children, you say they belong to one partner or the other. We became pregnant together, by choice, a lot of expense and work. We raised these children together, year after year. How can these children belong to one of us but not the other? If my partner leaves me and the child we created, I'm not entitled to child support, but if your spouse left you, your children would be entitled to it. Is that fair? As for health insurance, my partner works for the State and has excellent coverage. I work for a small company with no access to health insurance. I and "my" children can't go on my partner's health insurance, even though we're willing to pay the premiums, because we're not married. So I get to buy private insurance for a family at nearly 3x the rate. I'll bet you and your spouse haven't had any trouble using the health insurance provided by either of your employers. Also, at tax time, my partner and I can't file together and claim the children as tax deductions. Because of her income, it would be more beneficial for her to claim the kids, but she cannot, because we're not married and she is not the biological parent of the children. So we pay higher taxes and pay more to raise and support our kids and ourselves than you do. We're all under and pay into the same tax system, but we don't all receive the benefits from it. Those are just the most obvious and agregrious benefits marriage couples receive that same-sex couples do not.
Cobra Commander, I wrote anon 11:22 and I didn't go into religion. It's not about the sex or hating. It's tradition, men and women who get married usually end up with children who are the responsibility of both unless one, either the man or woman, is gone or dissolves the union. Because of traditions, we have kept this union and it has become more of a property, benefits,etc. issue but Gay people don't have to go thru this. Legal documents splitting property and health benefits are available to them. Why would you want to be on someone else's health insurance? it's a hassle even when you're married.
I'd like to also point out that there is absolutely no "separation of church and state" in the constitution. Look it up, you won't find it. Marriage and the ceremonies that resulted were never intended as a legal institution. I'd also like someone to give me my marriage benefits that cost so much, I've never seen a dime. If you're talking taxes, then there's the marriage penalty, I've heard of that. You're better off claiming head of household or Married filing separately than Married filing joint. Ask any accountant.
if our creator i wont say god becuse people believe in many different things wanted it that way then he/she would have created just one sex right? correct me if i am wrong but i believe it says in the bible somewhere that homosexuality is wrong. I myself dont mind if men or woman want to be together ,but as far as having the right to get married no it shouldnt be allowed and they shouldnt be allowed to adopt children. Do you have any idea how confusing that would be for a child to have two moms or two fathers?
Who wants to guess how much money it would cost a gay couple to contract for the hundreds of things married people take for granted? Also, there are hundreds of things we can't contract for to protect ourselves because the state and federal government doesn't recognize our family.
3:42 PM, then if gays can't adopt then homeless black woman, drug addict white men, psychologically disadvantaged black men, and slutty white woman should all have their genitals removed.
It's ok for straight people to f*ck up the children, but lord forbid a homosexual couple wanted to adpot. Homosexual are some of the most affluent people with higher educations, great jobs, and wonderful homes, that's a fact.
To anon 11:01 The only time I think two men should be in bed together is when there is a woman between them.
keepinitreal know what time it is for sure
Whoopi Goldberg did a great job explaining the difference between civil unions and marriages.
In a gay civil union, a partner dies and the surviving partner doesn't get what the dead partner left for them, unless a very specific will is made, and even then, the family of the dead partner will have heavier clout in contesting than the surviving partner.
It's a legal thing.
Live and let live, people. Let God take care of God things, and let legal things be legal things. I think Jesus said something about that with the rendering unto Caesar statement.
I see more hate coming from the pro-gay marriage crowd than from the anti-gay marriage crowd
ANON 8:49 You are so on the mark:
I think the "religious" argument for homosexuality should be argued in religious circles, not in public, political circles. We are supposed to have separation of church and state.
Thank you for writing that so well. This issue being voted on at all especially with a yes result was demoralizing. It is the same as voting to negate black rights or any other minority rights.
I really don't think it is right for me to be able to vote that you can't have your basic civil rights because you feel differently than me about the chosen race of your attraction. It's inconceivable to me that we allow this type of voting at all let alone that it got passed.
You should not push your religion on others, its YOURS - not mine or thiers. If you believe in all that fire and brimstone crap then it's the gay people that are going to burn in hell, not you - why does it concern you so much?
I will never understand why we vote on issues like this. I hope that someday we really can be a united EQUAL country who gives the same rights to all that we call "American" citizens.
Anon 8:11 and other people that are using HIV as a "gay only" thing that will kill off "only gay people" ... Apparently, most of South Africa is gay then since that is where the majority of HIV victims are
So.....gay people are better educated,make more money and have nicer homes????Apparently they have an inflated sense of self-esteem and their own importance too.I have no problem with "civil unions" between same sex partners but its hard to defend you when you make blanket statements about straight people like you have.You deserve no special rights because you are "different" or live what they call an "alternative lifestyle" ,just EQUAL rights.
I agree with 7:04 am. Maybe things haven't been that civil on either side, but when I read articles like these, I see a lot of hypocrisy in the hatred directed towards some of those who support Prop 8. Don't we have to give tolerance to receive tolerance, or should we just get plain old revenge?
http://familyleader.net/Home/servlet/viewArticle?contentId=2316
In California, Prop 8 was simply to define traditional marriage as between a man and a woman. It has nothing to do with denying rights to anyone. Many of those who support Prop 8 aren't doing it to discriminate and take away rights, they are doing it because of their moral and religious foundations. Is it fair to threaten them and call them "hate-mongerers" and "homophobics" simply because they have different moral and religious beliefs? I personally don't think so.
To Anon 1:03 - You said, "It has nothing to do with denying rights to anyone." Um, yes it did. It took away the right to marry for same sex couples who were already married. Where does that leave them legally? Now that it has passed it denies same sex couples the right to marry.
You correctly stated that the supporters of Prop 8 were "doing it because of their moral and religious foundations." Where is the separation of church and state? If you can legislate and dictate to others how they should live based on your religious beliefs, they can do the same to you. Are you ready for that? Once you open the door to a theocracy, it's hard to go back. Islam is the fastest growing religion. Are you ready to obey the laws of Islam should the majority of people in our country legislate that way?
If you don't believe in same sex marriage, don't have one, don't perform those ceremonies in your church, but don't reach outside your church, into my home and my life and tell me how I should live and who I can marry.
Why the hell does anyone care about gay people being married? If you don't like it don't marry someone of the same sex. Its not your choice its theirs. The government does not have a right to interject religious beliefs into laws or policies. Yet this is acceptable? How about interracial marriages? They are legal and yet there is supposedly wrong with that in the bible. The mentality is that someone elses decisions effect you how? It doesn't. I think its dumb that anyone is bothered by what anybody else does in their lives. Thats called being a busy body. Mind your own business and you won't be bothered. The whole gay argument.....how about priests molesting little boys. They are supposedly married to the church yet have the need to touch and molest little boys. There is the basis of your religion huh? The people saying follow the bible. Sodom was destroyed for its sins. Yet the people preaching the "laws of the bible" are breaking them too. Sick mentalities.
If all of you are really anti-gay you should vote for gay marriage so they could as miserable as the rest of us.
Post a Comment