Last night My wife and I went grocery shopping at Wal-mart. We used to go to Food Lion, but the costs are too high. Point is we go to Wal-mart in an attempt to save money. Ya know.....fiscal responsibility. Anyway, we are walking down the isle and a person (me anyway and I don't care who likes it) can't help but notice the extremely high percentage of Hispanic people present - if for no other reason but due to the fact that as they speak to each other you can't understand what they are saying. After making this observation, I noticed one particular woman, obviously of hispanic descent, with a shopping cart containing 10 gallons of milk. 10 gallons of milk. I thought: "how can a family possibly consume 10 gallons of milk before it goes bad?". A few seconds later I saw that she was holding several papers in her right hand. As I walked by her I noticed they were WIC checks. I brought this to the attention of my wife and she just rolled her eyes and asked me why I get all worked up about things like this. I bit my tounge and continued shopping. As we continued to wander up and down the isles I observed a couple with a small child who were shopping who were, again, obviously of Hispanic descent. In the womans right hand was what? You guessed it....WIC checks! At this point I was in disbelief. These folks were speaking spanish and I know in my heart they weren't born here. WIC checks....indeed! "My tax dollars at work", I thought. But I carried on. When we got in the check out line, two families up from us there was another Hispanic family. To my horror the woman of the family was carrying .....WIC CHECKS! The man was wearing a short sleave shirt covered in Spanish, which is his right, but moved me toward believing that these folks weren't born here.
Call me a racist if you wan't and I can't prove that these folks were illegal......but the chances of them being here legally in this area is slim.
A friend of mine recently went to a school geared toward the administrations of Law Enforcement Agencies. One of the speakers was from the Federal Govt. This speaker stated that a major reason that our govt. isn't pushing the illegal immigration issue is that most of these folks who work, pay into the Social Security System under a ficticious SS number. They continue to pay into it without any hope of collecting from it. It is simply an underhanded ploy to keep a failing system afloat.
Is this really working? Aren't they taking more out of one system (welfare, WIC, other social programs) than they are putting into another? Aren't they costing the American public more by getting sick and going to the hospital and never paying their bills thereby pushing healthcare costs up for everyone else in order to recover those losses? Or by leaving houses and apartments they rent without paying their last two months electric bills thereby increasing the costs to everyone else to recover those losses?
When we got into the car it was raining like a cow pi**ing on a flat rock. I was less than happy with my shopping experience. My wife said "I don't understand why you get so upset over these things. "They're" going to do what they want anyway. They don't care (meaning the govt.) and nothing's gonna change". I told her that it's an attitude like that which has brought us to this point. Now......call me a racist. Let's have it.
I think tomorrow I'm going to go register for WIC. We have two children still. I just may qualify. While I'm at it, I'm going to apply for welfare and get a check from them - or an "independence" card. Just think of the money I'll save since I won't have to pay for health care anymore. The govt. will pay for my housing under Section 8. I'll just put it in the backs of hardworking Americans. How....."American".
DelMarVa's Premier Source for News, Opinion, Analysis, and Human Interest Contact Publisher Joe Albero at alberobutzo@wmconnect.com or 410-430-5349
44 comments:
My biggest pet peeve in a grocery store line is when I am behind someone with WIC checks in their hand using them to buy all this great food while I stand there with my few items that I have worked all for - and I am paying cash! I am a single MOM, have WORKED my entire life to make ends meet, never received a nickel of child support (the law is pretty screwed up) - and yet others like the post mentions are eating and living much better than me - ON WIC Checks! I dont qualify for WIC because I work and have some money in savings!
Grand Dad,
Not all Hispanics are born here, that does'nt mean they are illegal! I happen to be born in Puerto Rico, "US TERRITORY".
I do agree on one thing, there are a lot of illegals in this area, and what angers me is, that they come here make money and send it to there country, this is the main reason why our economy is so bad.
I myself have always been blessed to of afforded our kids formula, for my husbands has a good career.
I agree that it is frustrating, mainly because I know some of them and although great people, it frustrates me to hear them brag on the houses they have build with US money, not only that but they probably collect, WIC, with one name, FOODSTAMP and CASH ASSISTANCE with another name, and are probably employed under a different name, I know someone that has 2 names, FRUSTRATING!
With all due respect, Grand Dad, it's not just illegals that take advantage of the system. We fine Americans do a pretty good job of that ourselves.
I know folks that own their own businesses, live in $250,000-$300,000 homes and have lots of nice gadgets, yet were qualified for WIC and state medical care for the kids because at the end of tax season their income fell within the guidelines. It's all in how you work those numbers, isn't it?
And need I mention all of our upstanding citizens that ride the welfare train for most of their lives, giving birth to more children and then collecting more money? Our problems with the redistribution of money go far beyond some illegal hispanics getting WIC checks; our own people have been taking advantage of the system for decades. But perhaps the furor over illegals will be the straw that finally breaks the camels back and leads to real change. Maybe.
One, being Hispanic does not necessarily mean they are illegal. There are plenty of Hispanics here who are legal, whether they are citizens, on temporary work visas, are legal immigrants, or are from Puerto Rico. Don't just assume that brown skin makes one a law breaker.
Two, illegals can't sign up for government benefits. If they were using WIC, it either means they are legal, are using it for their citizen children, or are benefitting from massive government fraud. Except in the last case, I don't see what the concern is.
Three, illegals pay taxes at the same rate as other people in their income class (whether sales, income, or payroll taxes). And they burden the system less than other people of their income class, considering that they can't use government programs. If you are really concerned about the costs they impose on society, then a much bigger problem is the U.S. citizens who rely heavily on government programs and use emergency rooms and send their kids to public school. Those of us paying taxes suffer far more from them than from illegals.
In virginia they don't make them stand there with WIC checks. They give them pretty little credit cards with a Cardinal on it. They call them Freedom cards and the Government puts X # of $$ in the account each month for them to spend.
PS: If you don't want to see these checks don't grocery shop during the first week of the month.
The WIC program is designed to provide innocent CHILDREN good nutrition. It is also valuable to American farmers as WIC purchases help alleviate the inevitable agricultural surpluses, and therby help keep commodity prices up.
It is petty and pathetic to hear fortunate people resent the poor even the meager food on their tables. What would Jesus say?? Probably something like "The poor will be with you always." (Matthew 26:11)
Do some shiftless and unlawful adults benefit as well? Count on it, as we will never change basic human nature. However, for my (tax) money, I'd much rather see children fed and farmers supported than the dishonest and unethical millionaires at Halliburton, Blackwater and the like. Besides it is much, much cheaper. Sound fiscal policy, really.
I am a single MOM, have WORKED my entire life to make ends meet, never received a nickel of child support (the law is pretty screwed up) - and yet others like the post mentions are eating and living much better than me - ON WIC Checks! I dont qualify for WIC because I work and have some money in savings!
Well did you even try????? There are alot of people who work and do qualify and to ann 1032, thats right it is for the children and a great thing. I am american, born and raised here, and white. i work and my husband works, and we are getting wic, and baby formula is expensive.
Why do the majority of you assume that these people are not working. Especialy the hispanics! Last time I checked hispanic people are about the only people I see working crappy jobs. Feel free to double check these numbers but the level of income to be eligible for WIC is around $39,000.00 for a family of four. WIC provides not only INFANT FORMULA, which is very very expensive but, milk, cereal, cheese, 100% fruit juice and mabey a few other things. NO junk food, it is not welfare, it is available to a large majority of people. Some however are smarter than others to see if they are eligible. WIC stands for Women, Infants and Children.
I think Jesus would say, "send all illegals back where they belong and don't give the families of illegals anythig as a reweard for breaking our immigration laws." I mean, Jesus was a good guy, but he wasn't stupid like our politicians!
Be that as it may, what about the individuals that make 2 seperate purchases at the grocery stores...the 1st purchase is the milk, bread, etc. they make with the WIC checks. Then they have another pile of groceries right behind that containing Ho-Hos, Twinkies, cigarettes, chips, etc. & they open their purse/wallet to get out $80 cash to take care of that transaction. Why can't the $80 go toward food that is better for the children?!?! This will also keep them from using my $ to go to the doctors all the time?!?!? These are the type of groceries I now have to tell my kids they can not have because it is not good for them & the price of them are too high for me waste $ on. But it brings me back to reality when I think about how these poor folks have to do something with their time because they do not have a job & I would hate to take their "party" time away from them (while I work 6 to 7 days a week). WELCOME TO AMERICA!!!!
Up until 2 years ago our income still qualified us for WIC and despite the rising costs of milk and eggs,I stopped using it and here is why.
To get these vouchers,you have to keep regular appointments with WIC officers in your local health department where nutrition information is given and your child is given a brief medical exam.
Well on the last appointment I had,I showed up ON TIME for my 11 AM appointment and at the time I stormed out of there,an hour had passed and I still had not been "received".WHY?Because the appointment before me was a non-English speaking woman with multiple children and the excuse given to me by the clinician was it took longer because everything had to be translated back and forth.WTF?I do not need anything bad enough to tolerate that.
After that I NEVER went back,although I could have remained eligible for another 6 months because of medical need(some people who don't fall under income can still qualify if they have a special "nutritional needs" issue-it our case I had gestational diabetes.)
It is a good thing that childrens nutritional needs are being met by health officials but the illegal "breeders" have flooded the WIC program to the point of pushing out US.If you don't have to work you do not mind waiting in a WIC office for 3 or 4 hours of your day but some of us do not have that luxury because as Americans we have taxes to pay and medical bills to pay off!
Another pissed off American!
You know in your heart they weren't born here? Because no American citizen speak Spanish?
Heres something even funnier.....I work at a package store and see able-bodied healthy people,even grown men,pull out their wallets to pay and they have those damn Independence Cards to buy their food-how do I get one?I asked one guy and he is "disabled"-how you say?He has a defective elbow-it keeps bending and bringing booze to his mouth.What a sham!
I hate even going into a grocery store at the beginning of the month. I do think WIC is a good program from my understanding they are limited to certain items. The items are usually cheese, milk, juice and things that are actually good for the children. The problem I have is that most of these people are illegal and have come here had a child (which makes the child legal and available for these free services) and are depending on us to support them. Go to any place that has western union on a Friday and there is a line of people sending money back to their family in another country. How much of another countries economy are we supporting since the money being made here is being sent there to be spent?
Ok Im sorry this is so long but its worth the read
ILLEGAL ALIEN "CONTRIBUTIONS" TO THE U.S.
2006 (First Quarter) INS/FBI Statistical Report on Undocumented Immigrants
CRIME
95 % of Warrants in LOS ANGELES are for ILLEGAL ALIENS
83 % of Warrants for MURDER in Phoenix Arizona are FOR ILLEGAL ALIENS
86 % of Warrants for MURDER in Albuquerque New Mexico are for ILLEGAL ALIENS
75 % of those on the most wanted list in Los Angeles , Phoenix , and Albuquerque are ILLEGAL ALIENS
24.9 % OF ALL INMATES in California detention centers are Mexican Nationals here ILLEGALLY
40.1 % of all inmates in Arizona detention centers are Mexican Nationals here ILLEGALLY
29 % (630,000) Convicted ILLEGAL ALIENS felons fill our state and federal prisons at the cost of $1.5
Billion Annually
53 % Plus of all investigated burglaries reported in California , New Mexico , Nevada , Arizona and Texas
are perpetrated by ILLEGAL ALIENS
50 % Plus of all gang members in Los Angeles are ILLEGAL ALIENS
71 % Plus of all apprehended Cars stolen in Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, and California were
stolen by ILLEGAL ALIENS or "Transport Coyotes”
47 % of cited / stopped Drivers in California have NO License, NO Insurance, and NO Registration for the
vehicle of that 47 %, over 92 % were ILLEGAL ALIENS
63 % of cited / stopped Drivers in Arizona have NO License, NO Insurance, and NO Registration for the
vehicle of that 63 %, over 97 % are ILLEGAL ALIENS
66 % of cited / stopped Drivers in New Mexico have NO License, NO Insurance, and NO Registration for
the vehicle of that 66 %, over 98 % were ILLEGAL ALIENS
BIRTHS
380,000 Plus "ANCHOR BABIES" were born in the U.S. in 2005 to ILLEGAL ALIEN PARENTS, making 380,000 babies automatically U.S. Citizens
97.2% of all costs incurred from those births were paid for by American taxpayers.
66 % OF all births in California are to illegal alien Mexicans on Medi-Cal whose births were paid by taxpayers
HOUSING
300,000 plus illegal aliens in Los Angeles Country are living in garages
Nearly 60 % of all occupants of HUD properties in the United States are illegal aliens.
TV & RADIO STATIONS
14 out of 31 TV stations in L.C. are Spanish only
16 out of 28 TV stations in Phoenix are Spanish only
15 out of 24 TV stations in Albuquerque are Spanish only
21 radio stations in Los Angeles are Spanish only
17 radio stations in Los Angeles are Spanish only
17 radio stations in Albuquerque are Spanish only
SCHOOLS
34% plus of Arizona students in grades 1-12 are illegal aliens and 24% plus are non-English speaking
39% plus of California students in grades 1-12 are illegal aliens and 42% plus are non-English speaking
In Los Angeles County , 5.1 million people speak English - 3.9 million speak Spanish
SOCIAL SERVICES
43 % of all Food Stamps issued are to illegal aliens
41 % of all Unemployment Checks in the United States are to illegal aliens
58 % of all Welfare payments in the United States are issued to illegal aliens
Less than 2 % of illegal aliens are picking crops but 41 % are on welfare
POPULATION
Over 70% of the U.S. annual population growth (and over 90% of CA, FL, and NY) results from immigration
EMPLOYER PROFITS
The estimated profit to U.S. corporations and businesses employing illegal aliens in 2005 was more than 2.36 trillion
TAXES
62 % of all "undocumented immigrants" in the U.S. are working for cash and not paying taxes, predominantly illegal aliens are working without a green card
The cost of immigration to the American taxpayer in 1997 (last known calculation by Professor Donald Huddle, Rice University ) was a NET (after subtracting taxes immigrants pay), $70 Billion per year. [What are the 2006 costs?]
The lifetime fiscal impact (taxes paid minus services used) for the average illegal alien is $55,000 cost to the American taxpayer in a 5-year span. You personally pay $11,000 every year to illegal aliens.
JOBS (per Center for Immigration Studies - September 2006): Between 2000 and 2005, 4.1 million immigrant workers arrived in the U.S., accounting for 86% of the net increase in the total number of employed persons (16 & older), the highest share ever recorded in the U.S. Of the 4.1 million, between 1.4 and 2.7 million are estimated to be illegal aliens. Also, between 2000 and 2005, the number of young (16 to 34) native-born men employed declined by 1.7 million - at the same time, the number of new male immigrant workers increased by 1.9 million. [Do you still believe the government employment rate stats?]
our govt is pretty jacked up when it comes to immigration. i used to work in DC on and around construction sites and spoke with several hispanics who werent illegal but had a working visa. they would come here for six months out of the year with several others and work after six months they would return to their country of origin most from mexico and would live the next six months like kings. they would reutrn in another six months to do it again and by the way they paid zero taxes while they worked here! i have no problem with the govt giving wic to people who actually work ,but cant make it on their income alone. what really gets me is people who collect these benefits and dont work at all. i have been in gas stations several times and seen people wearing leather coats driving nice cars with big crome wheels then pay for all the items they got in the store with an independance card paid for by other hard working tax payers.
Why does this persistent racism thrive on this blog? Some good points are raised at this site, but this xenophobic trash taints the whole place.
Wic doesn't give you "all this great food" they provide formula for a baby under a year old, 1 box of gerber rice cereal after 6 months and 4 bottles of juice after 8 months. After a year until 5 they provide milk, eggs, beans, cereal and juice. Wic isn't about the parents getting lavish food, it's about little children eating well. You aren't allowed any "sweats" with this, you get nutritious food. If you want to attack a program attack one that needs major repair-- the welfare system.
I raised a child BY MYSELF with VERY little child support ($25.00) a week which barely covered diapers. I did not even attemt to use the taxpayers as my provider. I was responsible for every bit my child ate. I also paid all of his doctor bills. It,s called PRIDE which many of these people have NONE. If they can't afford the one they have then why have six more. I quite frankly am tired of paying for mine and yours too.
Here is a novel idea. If you can't afford to buy your child milk and other staples, CLOSE YOUR LEGS. Put your stuff back in your pants and don't get pregnant or get anyone pregnant. If you do get pregnant or get someone pregnant TOUGH. It is not the goverments job to give you my tax dollars to support your little bundle of joy
anon 6:09...Amen !!!! Most if not ALL WIC participants are WELFARE participants as well. It is not MY job to pay for YOUR kids, as I had only one because I could not PROVIDE for more. It is YOUR responsibility to provide for YOUR children. YOU had the pleasure and now you can PAY for it. Please forgive me but I do not eat half as good as these poor people who have new cars, freshly painted fingernails, toe nails, and a cell phone with all the cool ringtones.If they can afford the luxury of those items, they can pay for their OWN healthy food.
"One, being Hispanic does not necessarily mean they are illegal. There are plenty of Hispanics here who are legal, whether they are citizens, on temporary work visas, are legal immigrants, or are from Puerto Rico. Don't just assume that brown skin makes one a law breaker."
Sorry, Marc. We're just not so enlightened here. A bunch of Eastern Shore rubes we are.
Thanks for spending the time trying to educate us though. We'll try harder next time.
P.S., Marc, your country is vanishing in front of your face, barely in one generation. Wake up!
anon 4:11...BUY YOUR OWN !!
I have a right to complain about paying for YOUR kids. You should have put that baby formula in your budget plan because I didn't put your financial issues in mine but yet I am forced to pay for it.
We are in the USA.......speak English dammit!! And have all the kids you want as long as you can pay for their needs. I should not have to work 40 hours a weeek to feed someone else's children.
It never ceases to amaze me how people think. Truly the most powerful force in the world is ignorance. I feel sad for them using only stereotypes and little knowledge to make assumptions. I’m a white male and an American citizen. Because of my job and travel I’m fluent in 3 languages. If you heard me speaking to my wife in say French or Spanish would you assume I was illegal? Please ponder these ideas the next time you make assumptions. You don’t know if they are legal or not. Even if they were not do you want to starve the innocent children to make your point? Your family at one time in history made the same journey to this country as they did. I’m sure they encountered the same kind of people saying the same types of things people are saying here. I would guess that many of the ones critical here would not pick and travel thousands of miles in order to start a better life for them and their family. As for taxes even if they are illegal they are still paying them by way of gas tax, sales tax, etc…
The world is changing my friend. It’s never going to go back to the way it was in the past. You will be hearing a mix of languages and cultures much of the same way as it was at the turn of the 19th to the 20th century.
I love it when American forget history. One of the most beautiful statements in our country is the following: We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.
I guess this statement should not apply does not to hispanics.
How about this quote:
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
I was driving down the road yesterday with my wife and saw the the polluted waters and breathed the unhealthy air. We stopped and heard people speaking what had to English and i know they or the their family are the ones who stole our land and destroyed our culture. You think you have a problem with immigration ask an American Indian his opinion pale face!
i can always tell when checks come because the shelves are empty
You have to think bigger! You are on earth! LEARN a second language and expand your mind! Just because someone is speaking a different language does not mean the are talking about you. Have a little self confidence. Then again maybe they are talking about you.
Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.
Mark Twain
You think you have a problem with immigration ask an American Indian his opinion pale face!
whooo hoooooo someone that thinks almost like me. One thing I'd change, is the "pale face" comment, that died with the Lone Ranger. :)
Did this commenter forget something of great importance?
Mitakuye oyasin? Did this fall by the wayside?
Donna
If you want to start taking care of those hispanic "brown people" Here is some legal languaged used in the past to start the process in this country. This applies to all of the proud to be racist people on this blog.
Each group/race will have different rights, food rations, allowed strips in the cities, separated residential areas, special schooling systems, public transportation and restricted restaurants - Adolf Hitler.
You will be in company in the way you are thinking a speaking.
I don't care who the hell they're talking about. Pay for you own food! Don't be ridiculous. If you don't recognize that illegal immigration is a very serious problem, your naive. Illegal aliens are creating an incredible strain on our economy which, if left unchecked, will be a major cause of our economic demise.
I can't believe how many liberal morons that are here in this country and feel it is ok to pay for welfare mongers to have sex and procreate. WTF are you people thinking? I can barely pay my own bills much less theirs. If the liberals think it is ok to support the illegals then they should be the ones to pay more taxes.
Granddad, thank you for the post. You must have just missed me at WalMart cuz I was there when it was raining. But wait, everytime I go into WalMart I am the minority. I was in there last night (June 01)and couldn't even find a steak to cook on my grill. There were so many foriegners buying up what was left and they had the Independence Card to pay for it. Must be nice. No more Food Stamps because we don't want to embarrass them so we will give them a credit card at tax payers expense.
I take it your wife is either soft hearted or pretty liberal.
Donna Mitakuye oyasin?id not fall by the wayside. I know it but did not include it since it would be well beyond the depth of knowledge of these racist bloggers. They only think in terms of themselves. I feel for them and the way narrow way in which they view the world. I do care for them becuase they are All are my relations.
I have personal experience with US Customs and INS (now USCIS) and I can tell you it would be very strange for the FBI and a Treasury Department, now DHS, agency to issue such a joint report.
The fact that this report cannot be found anywhere except on our anti-illegal immigration web sites is very disconcerting.
We MUST always ensure we’re dealing with the FACTS, passing along FACTS and not rumors.
The pro-illegal, pro-amnesty Treason Lobby looks for false information like this to accuse us of spreading lies.
The 2006 (First Quarter) INS/FBI Statistical Report on Undocumented Immigrants is a complete FAKE!
Don't pass along hate. Pass along compassion.
heres what everyone forgets...the farm lobby supports programs like these because it drives up the cost of food to the hard working, paying folk
IMO we ought to gut all these programs, and allow local officers to enforce immigration laws
Yes baby formula is very expensive and guess what I have twins. I have a family of 5 me and my husband work we get no help at all. We pay for every thing for our 3 kids. No WIC and my twins use a can of formula a day. I see people everyday in a grocery store getting WIC or using foodstamp cards. People who use foodstamps eat better than anyone I have ever seen. They buy snow crab legs, shrimp, steak, crabmeat the list goes on and on. We make it by just fine because I know how to budget my money to buy formula, diapers, and food. My children get everything they need. I know some people that have WIC and foodstamp the choose not to work full time jobs or limit their schedule so they can still get WIC and foodstamps. I thing the system is not fair.
Anyone who thinks illegals are putting a strain on our economy doesn't know what he is talking about. You might want to actually look into how undocumented workers help our economy before blasting them: http://www.americansforimmigrationreform.com/
And how is our country "vanishing in front of us"? Did our country vanish when we had large waves of Italians or Irish immigrants come early last century? No, while these immigrants faced the same xenophobia and racism that Hispanics face today, they eventually assimilated.
And as far as the list of "facts" posted at 2:21, again, you might want to do a little research. These "facts" are, in fact, pretty much made up: http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/taxes.asp.
Everyone is so worried about tax dollars going to fund illegal aliens but that is only a small fraction of the tax dollars being used to fund the war in Iraq and Afghanistan. The numbers aren't even close.
If you want more of something, subsidize it. If you want less of something, tax it.
In this country, we tax income, savings, capital gains, alcohol, and gas.
We subsidize single parents, people who don't work, people who can't stop having kids, and stupidity.
No we shouldn't be taxing poor people and single parents, But when San Diego puts up an ILlegal immigrant crossing sign, at the border, we have a problem. If we know so many criminals cross there, why not stop them.
And based on the VERY limited number of various work visas, most of the hispanics here ARE illegal. They ARE breaking the law. They ARE documented - documented law breakers.
I'm always amused when the liberals say "We can't go around and try to round up twenty million illegals...it's just not feasible."
REALLY?!?!
We've been trying to round up twenty million pot smokers for about 20 years now. Is there any difference. Look at the measures our gov't is taking to fight this war on drugs. The DEA dna tests confiscated weed now so they can track down the source. If we put half those resources toward fighting illegal immigration, imagine what could happen.
The next time you Pro-illegal immigration people get all high and mighty, think about how the gov't would react if all the pot smokers had rallies and parades like all the illegals do.
BC in NC
Now, everybody wonders why I vote republican. This is a good example.
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