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Saturday, January 26, 2008
A SU Student Claims They Were There
"I would like to provide a few more details to provide a more balanced perspective on the incident, as I was there when this occurred. Firstly, there were only about 6 people in the residence. Secondly, The person that was beaten and restrained by police had answered the door, and it was at this time that the officer entered the apartment, claiming probable cause for having smelled illegal substances. While there were certainly faults by both parties involved, the harrasment, name calling and verbal abuse incurred by the students, in addition to the excessive force used by the officers to restrain the individual, were beyond what was necessary. To also be fair and balanced, an officer did allow water to be poured over the maced student's face. Whether this was due to the third parties present watching the events is unclear. Questioning a person's belief in God while berating them is not standard police procedure, at last I checked. Unfortunately, I suspect that, as usual, the reputation of students at this institution will only lead the court's to be in favor of the police as so often happens. A serious look needs to be taken at the tactics and procedures of police towards students of this community, students providing this community with their money and economic support. It seems obvious where we fall in the police's eyes."
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27 comments:
". . . Unfortunately, I suspect that, as usual, the reputation of students at this institution will only lead the courts to be in favor of the police . . ."
Actually, the hostility toward students by the SFD and the outrageous and illegal conduct of certain of its members towards SU students is notorious in the local courts, which have thrown out numerous prosecutions in which the defendants had competent legal counsel. Ask around campus for which local attorneys to contact.
SU STUDENTS:
UNITE!
Attend the Salisbury City Council meeting on Monday, Jan. 28; it starts at 6 PM. During the public comment segment speak out. If Louise Smith (Council Pres.) tries to muzzle you, tell her that you want your vote back.
PS -- if you see a bald man, not in uniform, wearing an expensive suit, it's probably the police chief.
Vox Populi
Fair and balanced my ass!
First, it's clear that a party was going on and there were illegal substances at that party. This is why the suspect was charged with poss. of a controlled dangerous substance. A fact that is not disputed by the student writing all the overinflated accusations while picturing storm troopers in boots marching across UP. "YAH lets rally and stur up stuff! F the Police! WhooHoo! Now I have a cause to stand on my little soapbox for!" The student even goes so far as to call the police fascists..if they were, the student's would be sitting in a goolog right now eating what resembles oatmeal with insect larva in it, getting beaten with a rubber hose by a man with a broken nose and a sweating problem.
Second, by almost definition, students tend to be more liberally minded than adults who wish to live in peace in their community.
Third, Salisbury university students do not keep the city alive with their attendance. Salisbury thrives with or without students, as seen when they leave for summer breaks. Students may keep some South end business alive but only those who cater to students such as the Monkey Barrel and other such establishments. Yes Salisbury is a cesspool but hey if you don't want to spend your money in Salisbury, then go to fruitland or delmar and spend your money.
Fourth, the police do not go door to door looking for people to beat, generally speaking. Frankly, they have better things to do with their time. A call for service was generated at which time they responded and according to officers, who have inherently more credibility than students attending a party with illegal substances involved who are also intoxicated, encounter a person who resists arrest and assaults a law enforcement officer as noted in the charges under the previous blog entry. So an arrest is made. Using pepper spray, closed hand control, and baton use, and in some instances, use of deadly force, are justifiable uses of force to control a suspect resisting arrest or assaulting the police. I'm sure that if the suspects responded with "Yes, Sir. No, Sir" etc. and were compliant, force would have not been used without cause. Police officers (and deputies) should be inherently respected as societies outward symbol of control of the criminal population. I serously doubt that if the 10 students were sitting in the apartment having a group study session or playing monopoly, the police would have made contact with them. As students may roll their eyes at the last statement, as I know I would have in earlier days, it is a true statement.
Fifth, the entry into the apartment is subject to suppression if it is a 4th amendment issue so that is a court issue, not a complaint issue. If entry was legal, then the arrest and subsequent seizure of CDS was legal.
Sixth, people are "assaulted" all the time by the police. Assault is designated as an unwanted touching. However, most of the time when police come into contact with people, physically, it is legal in order to detain them for investigatory purposes, arrest them, defend themselves, check them for weapons, or search them for probable cause reasons.
Lastly, yes, the college students at UP are out of control. Frequently reports are taken for destruction to surrounding property at people's homes that for no reason are vandalized and you're tax payers money is going toward the salaries of police officers taking these senseless and unsolvable reports constantly. Preventing these issues, or rather SU kids not destroying things, would save thousands upon thousands of tax dollars yearly on police response and report generation time alone.
Also, the cases involving Dep. McMichael and Ofc Sparpaglione is a totally different agency first (McMichael) of all and second has no bearing on an alleged police brutality complaint at a university party, unless the police dept. still kept Sparpaglione on after his arrest, which they did not.
The odor of marijuana is definitely enough P/C for officers to go into the residence. The U.S. Supreme Court establishes the fact that the "plain view doctrine" extends to the sense of smell. Once inside, the officers have the right to:
Secure the premises;
Arrest all persons in the apartment(possession of CDS);
Search all arrested persons incident to the arrest;
Search the immediate area surrounding arrested persons;
AND - the officers can get a warrant to search every inch of the residence as well as the vehicles of the persons arrested if the evidence supports it.
Why is it that this writer says that the treatment of college students should be better? Their treatment should be no different than anyone else in that situation. It seems, from the information in comments on the previous related post, that the actions by officers were objectively reasonable.
Pepper spray is appropriately deployed immediately following the failure of a subject to comply with verbal commands and efforts to force compliance with soft hand tactics - if possible. It's called the use of force continuum.
Whether the person who thinks I'm an asshole in the last related post agrees with me or not, doesn't matter. The fact is, the person has been sprayed, arrested, and charged, and will now have his day in court. In my oppinion, anyone who thinks that college students can continue to have large parties that disrupt the good order of the surrounding communities, are products of poor upbringing.
These officers were doing their jobs. Good Work! Enforcement of existing laws relating to quality of life issues with zero tolerance for violators is the only way to address the issues that negatively affect the communities surrounding the "University".
I am still reserving my own personal judgement, but there are still unanswered questions:
-What was happening at this party before the police arrived?
-Was the noise level too high?
-Had there been complaints about this location before?
-Since most of the comments are anonymous it won't bea problem to anser this, what illegal substances were present and being used?
-What was the mood and reaction of the students to the police presence? Docile and cooperative, or combative and aggressive (regardless of police action?)
Again, I am not advocating the use of such extremem force in situations like this, and the police probably overreacted based on their (very legitimate) historical problems with portions of the University population. The students are fighting against a history of bad behavior on their part, and changing that percepion will take time.
To say that the studens involved were compeltely innocent is naive. To say that the police were compeltely unjustified is iased and uninformed. Somewere in the middle is the truth, as always.
It is up to the student population to make sure your image is not that of guys and girls from Jersey walking around with their hats on backwards, platic cups in their hands, and shouting and being disruptive for no reason other than, "the party, dude."
The police need to relax, but the students can help bring this about.
If you were there, why didn't you take some pics, or a short video of the incident with your cell phone??
Where's the evidence?
He said...She said...what a bunch of cow dung.
Most of these students think their entitled to smoke dope, drink, litter, make a ton of noise and if you don't like it tough.
If the cops started banging the shit out of these a-holes some of this stuff might stop.
Sir Robert Peel,
While I will not get into the fray of probable cause and police brutality, I will comment to the fact that Salisbury would stand on its own two feet without the University.
First, do you even live in Salisbury?
Second, are you slow or suffer from some sort of brain damage?
If not, you have to be one of the most ignorant people alive and probably depend on government checks anyway. The University is the largest economic driver in our community. Period. End of Story. The End. Perdue USED to be before it moved substantial operations to GA and NC and I can't say that I blame them. The business climate is much better there. The only reason why they even remain in this hole is because they started here and feel it is important to remain here.
The University brings job here and the only business expanding and adding new jobs with exception to the hospital. The students and their families go out to eat, stay in hotels and pay rent. The students and staff are solidfying my financial future through the money they spend in this town. If I were in the University's shoes, I would continue to expand taking more property off the city tax rolls and give the big "FU" to the city and its residents. The stuff they put up with borders on the ridiculous and quite frankly they shouldnt have to. All citizens of Salisbury should be thankful for the University's presence as its the only thing keeping this town alive.
As a resident of Salisbury and a taxpayer, I would like the Salisbury Police to BEAT the SHIT out of every mouthy, arrogant & self-entitled college student they come into contact with. And I am a college graduate myself. I had it done to me and I deserved it. It made me a better person and it stopped me from thinking I was a roadside lawyer...
It is plausible that these incidents do occur. I know first hand and from reliable sources that SPD has rolled up to students walking down the street demanding "whats in the bag". Sadly students comply even though the police have no probable cause to ask whats in the bag. If you comply, you give consent. Just say no sir, you do not have a right to look in my bag. Is that police work? Is that proper? NO IT ISN"T!
I have been harassed with my friends for "noise" in the middle of the day bbq'n on a saturday and absolutely there was no more noise comming from us than the traffic and others around us. We were all threatened with citations and the owners subject to arrest if they came back. Pretty much all of us were 21 except for a few, but it was not an all drunk fest...it was a bbq for the afternoon! No bottles being thrown, no one running around, no loud music, and we were in our own section of the lawn.
Our crime, being SU students.
Again I do not condone illegal substances or activity. Each individual assumes the risk and insuing penalites.
Catus...
well said 901 they need their ass kicked I have been to several of these calls in the past and lets not forget the time when all LE was called to respond a few years ago to asst. SPD when the studnets were out of control and the students began throwing full bottles / cans off beer at police we kicked their ass then and will do it again
I just love how "kicking their ass" seems to be the general consensus from this supposedly educated group of responders.
It could be the end of the world. Apocalypse... and some Salisbury resident would want to file a complaint that the young people were making to much noise.
I'm tired of talking about this. It will never end and the sides will always be the same.
** This message by some who is NOT a SU student.
When did this incident occur?? It had to be some time ago because students have just recently started filtering back into town. Why has it taken so long to hear about this or are these students just now filing a complaint against these officers. If you want something done you have to do it right away not wait for months to file a complaint. You should go while you have to proof and everything is fresh in the minds of all the parties involved.
it happened this past week. things like this have been complained about before but the mentality of certain salisbury residents tend to brush it off rather than investigate and take these reports seriously. hey does anyone find it odd that there are recently two big stories posted about the police busting people for serious drugs AFTER this student incident was brought up? maybe they are starting to work a little more just in case the mainstream media gets ahold of the situation at hand so they look better? PR stunt sort of thing? just a thought. either way im glad they busted these guys!
Hey, for your info Catus, police can ask anybody any question they want just like you or I can. It's not a violation of anyones rights unless you are being detained and ask for an attorney. Thats called proactive police work. More sidewalk attorneyism. People seem to think that police should only respond to calls for service and never try to stop crime before it happens. In case anyone hasn't noticed there are more and more college students selling dope now and they think its ok. Its all about self entitlement caused by there parents. I graduated in 2000and let me tell you how much things have changed with SU students. There are some that try to make a difference in the community and want to live peacefully. But there are way morte that don't give a crap about anyone who lives here and will dump on anyone who gets in their way. Great case in point the www.fuckit.com party and the parties over at the "zoo" (S. Division St homes). There are videos reels from WBOC on file from college kids out in droves walking around in public with open containers, screaming, yelling, and obviously under age possessing alcohol. I guess thats all police picking on poor college kids too huh? When I went to SU we respected our neighbors, gacve them our numbers to call if any of our guests got out of hand and made sure people weren't drinking and driving. Now they only seem to care about how drunk they can get and how fast.
"As a resident of Salisbury and a taxpayer, I would like the Salisbury Police to BEAT the SHIT out of every mouthy, arrogant & self-entitled college student they come into contact with."
They can't do that, as some students would fight back; all the little dick heads in the SPD would do is hide at the Ihop and rape young girls.
According to Anonymous 12:19:
"Actually, the hostility toward students by the SFD and the outrageous and illegal conduct of certain of its members"
SFD??? Now the Fire Department is raiding SU Parties?
Jim, the point is you can refuse to answer the question. Having a bookbag or being on the street is not probable cause. Thats harrassment. Now if it looks like they're walking around with a open container or acting the fool than yes. But just walking down the road with a bookbag or nothing is not justified.
Jim, I definately agree the drug use and distribution has gone up dramatically; coke, club drugs, pills of all types...Weed is the least of the concerns compared to the others. No one has ever od'd from weed and died. Still illegal and I cant condone it.
The online parties are non-existent now, things of the past.
Thank God I don't live close to SU, however, I do drive up and down RT 13 several times a week. For the seond year in a row, I have noticed a marked change in the way the young peope drive around town. They act like they own the road. If I did not have a calendar, I could tell you the day they move back to town. They are inconsiderate of everyone and are quick to get out on RT 13 at all cost and expect you to move over and let them get through. Since I have no idea of the facts of what happened, police being forceful without provocation is wrong. Hopefully justice will be served either way.
alot of people in salisbury like to sterotype don't they? i can counter that there are plenty of drivers who are not students who are horrible. of course you can tell when students are back at school because there are thousands of them who need to GET TO CLASS! i never had a ticket in my life nor have i been in any accidents and that has nothing to do with this story. you guys do not have anything to say but oh how salisbury students are out of control.. look at the last few stories that were put up. you want to talk about out of control and bad driving?! PSSSHHHHHHHH!!!!!
You know what I hear here??? Wahhhh Wahhh Wahhh....grow up and graduate college and stop your whining. Take the ass whoopins that you deserve...
I know this is a little late of a respone, but these college kids are from the "Time Out" era and never got their ass beat as kids by their parents. Parents are just too sensitive with their kids these days. I don't mean abuse your kids, I mean when you catch them playing with matches, you snatch them up and bust their ass. The older kids these days fear nothing, not their parents or police. I am thiry years old and if my dad tells me to hush up or calm down I do, cuz back in the day if I didn't I'd a wore is handprint on my face, and probably would today.
Times are changing that is what happens when you get older. A police officer's job is to serve and protect not play mommy and daddy just to beat the sh*t out of kids. That is not part of their job. Just because that is your way of handling things does not mean you are right. Go research how beating another individual can get you in trouble (even parents beating their children). You beat your kid which is your way of discipline for them, however, you do not overdo it because that would be inhumane and your child would most likely be taken from you for that. That is what these officers have done.
I didn't realize that SU students buying fast food, beer and cigarettes is the driving force behind Salisbury's economy. Obviously these students are not business majors.
The two walmarts, the mall, salons, grocery stores, gas stations (where we also buy gas not just beer and cigarettes), restaurants, pharmacies, and hotels are just some other things you left out. We also work in these places and many others. Not to mention we provide jobs by buying fast food which is a good thing which I learned in one of my business courses.
follow up on 1008 that party was the f--k it .com party i think it was around 2000-2001
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